Who was the leader of the ‘Others’ before Ben?
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By seedy
- Who was the leader of the ‘Others’ before Ben?
- Created: May 9, 2008
- Last updated: Aug 14, 2008
- After episode: 4.11: Cabin Fever
- Status: Current
- Flag this theory:
Charles Widmore - ‘I know who you are, boy. What you are. I know that everything you have you took from me…’
— seedy
In the season 3 DVD commentary for the ‘Man from Talahassee’ the produces describe Richard Alpert as being similar to a Panchen Lama choosing the next Dalai Lama. He and Ben keep each other in “check” by having the power to pick/veto each other’s replacement on the Island. The important point is that Richard doesn’t want to be leader, but is important in selecting the next potential leader.
I was interested in the similarities in Richard’s interaction between Ben & Locke. As we saw in ‘Cabin Fever’, Richard was present at multiple times in Locke’s childhood seemingly monitoring his progress. He also seems to have groomed Ben from early on. And in both cases there was considerable time between Richard’s initial contact and his specific attempt to manoeuvre Ben/Locke to the leadership. In Locke’s case, he criticises Ben’s leadership and assists Locke when Ben tries to embarrass him in front of the ‘Others’ (i.e. helps with the murder of Cooper). In Ben’s case, they are both involved in the ‘Purge’ and clearly have had contact prior to this event. Once Ben is installed as leader, Richard has to obey Ben, but still keep the look out for future leaders.
Interestingly, for whatever reason, Ben’s leadership is failing. He is having to ‘trap’ Jacob using the ash, he develops cancer and Jacob want Locke to help him! I think Ben is aware that Locke is here to replace him and is doing everything he can to exercise his veto! From the very beginning he tries to undermine Locke’s leadership skills, he tries to make the ‘Others’ doubt Locke he even tries to kill Locke (although he may have been testing whether the Island would let Locke die!). But it appears that Locke is finally usurping Ben as leader. And Richard has been helping all the way.
Which makes me wonder – who was the leader of the ‘Others’ before Ben? Richard doesn’t want to be leader, but was grooming Ben to be leader from early on during the Dharma Initiative. Therefore there must have been another leader at this point. And is it possible that since the leader seems to control who comes to the Island that maybe he was responsible for allowing the DI onto the Island? The original ideal being to use the Island’s properties for the betterment of mankind. But something went wrong, and the Island rejected the DI. At which point Richard and Ben worked together to remove the DI from the Island.
But, no matter how badly the leader screws up in his handling of Island affairs, he cannot be killed because of them. Therefore, the old leader is probably just ‘escorted’ from the Island. I imagine you can see where I’m going with this. Was Charles Widmore the leader of the ‘Others’ during the DI years. He is certainly very familiar with Ben and it may explain why Ben cannot kill Charles. And are the nightmares related to the dreams that Locke is also having.
And most damning of all is this quote from Widmore –
‘I know who you are, boy. What you are. I know that everything you have you took from me…’
Key characters
| Short Name | Full Name | Episodes | Theories |
|---|---|---|---|
| Anthony | Anthony Cooper | 186 | |
| Ben | Benjamin Linus | 3.20, 4.9, & 3” href=”/episodes/theres-no-place-home-parts-2-3/”>4.13 | 1717 |
| Charles | Charles Widmore | 406 | |
| John | John Locke | 3.3, 2.17, 1.4, 1.19, 3.13, 3.19, 4.11, & 3” href=”/episodes/theres-no-place-home-parts-2-3/”>4.13 | 1231 |
| Richard | Richard Alpert | 310 |
Key episodes
| # | Title | Aired | Central character | Theories |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| 3.20 | The Man Behind The Curtain | 5-9-2007 | Ben | 413 |
| 3.19 | The Brig | 5-2-2007 | John | 134 |
| 3.13 | The Man from Tallahassee | 3-21-2007 | John | 154 |
| 2.17 | Lockdown | 3-29-2006 | John | 148 |
| 2.16 | The Whole Truth | 3-22-2006 | Sun, Jin | 104 |
Perhaps Widmore is the previous leader. More likely is that Richard was the previous leader. As you point out, the commentary by the producers in season 3 suggests that Richard was searching for his replacement. Ben on the other hand did not want to give up his power and therefore tried to kill Locke and discredit him. The reason why Ben and Richard fell out of favor with the island is because they did not follow the plan. Richard allowed the Dharma initiative to come to the island while Ben was consumed with the idea of curing infertility on the island while ignoring the “bigger picture”.
You know, this post got largely looked over. I think you put into words what a lot of us were thinking. You are the first since Cabin Fever to bring up that Richard notably doesn’t want to be the leader. Great post, seedy, it’s too bad it’s getting looked over.
+1
Seedy, Another great post! +1
Prior to “The Others” there was the Dharma Initiative. Given that Horace Goodspeed had a map of Jacob’s cabin in his pocket when he died, I am wondering if he may have been Jacob’s helper, and is why Ben treated Horace with more respect than the DI people when he died.
We have wondered if Widmore had ever been to “the island”, so it is plausible that he could have, and was dethroned by Ben and banished, with Ben hiding “the island” again.
I believe Alpert is Jacob’s assistant, out to find the next successor as his main focus, along with doing some of Ben’s bidding, even though he is against some of what Ben does.
Undoubtedly, Ben has found a way to harness Jacob and keep him from interfering in his plans.
Great post! I never thought about Widmore being the previous leader, but I like the thought. It seems that Ben has some bitter feelings about not being ‘the chosen one’ any longer, and I’m sure that Widmore would have similar feelings about Ben. Ben’s vendetta against Widmore in the flash-forwards would make sense, as Ben was living peacefully on the island until Widmore got involved. Perhaps Ben with Widmore is Ben’s retaliation on him and his effort to make sure that Widmore never interferes with the island, which John is now responsible for, again.
Hmmm.. Widmore in charge invites Dharma and ostracizes his own people. A mutiny takes place and Ben takes over. Though as Ben suggests to Locke about how to lead (the whole “you’re getting the hang of [leading by manipulation]”), maybe Richard has been in charge ever since the purge. Maybe he’s manipulating Ben as a smokescreen to keep Widmore off his trail.
I agree that widmore may have been a previous leader. I think he turned on Dharma. Ben can’t kill him either because hes immortal because he still did not do the work for the island or him and ben are each others constants.
I like the idea of Charles being the previous leader of the others.
Helps explain his detailed knowledge of the island given the freighter has only just arrived at the island and the second protocol which includes knowledge of Ben’s next move.
Also assuming Charles is behind watching station at the one of the poles where there Portuguese dudes pick the electro magnetic anolomy from the Swan also hints at Charle’s knowledge of the Swan. And also him being at the auction to buy the book hints at his knowledge of the Black Rock.
Being on the island at some point would be very helpful in acquiring all this knowledge.