Locke is a red herring!
+14 14 Votes
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By Daryn
- Locke is a red herring!
- Created: May 15, 2007
- Last updated: Aug 29, 2008
- After episode: 3.20: The Man Behind The Curtain
- Status: Current
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The Others (hostiles), believe Ben to be their leader, in a spiritual sense – be it religion, a cult, prophecy, etc. They believe that someone special would lead them, under Jacob, connected somehow to Jacob. They also believe they will know this person because this person will kill his own father. When Ben killed his father, he seemed to complete the prophecy. However, it seems clear now that Ben is a “false prophet.” Among other things, he lies to his people, he keeps Jacob hostage, he got cancer, and he shot Locke before Locke could expose him.
It seems that many of his people have started to believe that Locke is actually the “chosen one,” for lack of a better term. After all, the island healed him, and his father is a despicable person. So they kidnapped his father and brought him to the island for Locke to murder him. Locke, not able to do so, eventually sets up Sawyer to do it, which he does.
So…… Locke is fulfilling the prophecy. He is going to be the leader. That’s certainly a reasonable and popular theory. It seems almost like more than a theory – a conclusion, based on the facts presented to us in the show.
And that’s exactly what the creators of LOST want us to conclude…. Just so they can twist us even further.
my theory: The creators of the show have given us all of this information to lead us to that theory. We figure it out, we pat ourselves on the back, we feel great. In truth, locke is a red herring.
Yes, he was healed miraculously. But wait… that island has healing properties that have affected many people. The woman who came in the helicopter – her lung was punctured and healed in a day. As Mikhail said, different rules apply to this island. YES, he killed his father, just like Ben. But wait….. he actually DIDN’T kill his father. He didn’t even tell Sawyer to kill his father. He just figured Sawyer would, based on what he read in Sawyer’s file. So he locked Sawyer in the same room with his Dad, and let them sort it out. After his Dad’s murder, Sawyer carried his Dad’s body back to the others, and told them that HE had killed him. Not technically true.
BUT….. there IS someone on the island that has killed her father. This person was even on the plane. KATE. Kate killed her father. Now, I know what you’re thinking – nope, Kate murdered her step-dad. Not true. It has actually been revealed that the man that Kate murdered was, in fact, her biological father. Here is a bio from lostpedia:
Wayne Janssen was Kate’s biological father, though he was likely unaware of this. He beat Kate’s mother Diane, was an alcoholic, and made sexual advances toward Kate (which she vehemently rebuffed). He was killed by Kate when she blew up his house. http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Wayne
The fact that he is, in fact, her biological father has been only revealed once, because the creators of the show want to throw us off track. They have to reveal it ONCE, so that the story has integrity, but then they have moved on.
The have led us to conclude that the others believe Locke is their leader, because their leader will kill his own father. And the others do believe that. And so do we. What they don’t know is that Kate actually is the one who killed her father. And Locke is leading them, ultimately, to Kate.
As a matter of fact, the theme of father issues has been HUGE part of the entire series. every major character (of the survivors) have had BIG problems because of their fathers! Check it out:
Locke – Father abandoned him at birth, stole his kidney, and pushed him out of a 9 story window.
Jack – Among other things, on Jack during his childhood. Taught him that he should not try to be a hero, because he does not have what it takes. Cheated on his mom. Tried to get Jack to lie about his dad operating under the influence. When he lost his license, his dad blamed Jack for ruining his life.
Kate - Wayne Janssen was Kate’s biological father, though he was likely unaware of this. He beat Kate’s mother Diane, was an alcoholic, and made sexual advances toward Kate.
Hurley – Hurley’s Dad left the family for 17 years. Out of frustration Hurley started overeating.
Sun – Her father forced her husband to work for him, forcing him to do dispicle things, which almost destroyed their marriage. Sun even planned to leave her husband because of the man he was becoming working for her father.
Jin – His Dad is a good man. But his social class a fisherman has affected and haunted Jin almost his entire life, creating huge obstacles for him. Jin’s dad is a great man, but who he is has caused Jin;s life many problems, to the point that Jin told everyone, including his own wife, that his parents are dead.
Sawyer – Jame’s parents were swindled out of their life savings by a man known as Sawyer, who slept with James’ mother. James ultimately witnessed his father murder his mother, and finally turn the gun on himself in despair
Charlie - Charlie’s father, vehemently opposed the career choice, and believed that Charlie and his brother Liam should become butchers like him, leading to much confusing and lack of confidence on Charlie.
Claire – Her father, also Jack’s father, left her as a baby, because he had another family in America.
For three seasons, flashbacks have outlined every major character’s father, and shown us that every major character still living has big issues with their fathers. It’s a huge theme of the show. And it’s there for a reason. And, mark my words, it’s going to ultimately lead us to KATE.
i would love your thoughts….
Key characters
| Short Name | Full Name | Episodes | Theories |
|---|---|---|---|
| Ben | Benjamin Linus | 3.20, 4.9, & 3” href=”/episodes/theres-no-place-home-parts-2-3/”>4.13 | 1581 |
| John | John Locke | 3.3, 2.17, 1.4, 1.19, 3.13, 3.19, 4.11, & 3” href=”/episodes/theres-no-place-home-parts-2-3/”>4.13 | 1139 |
| Kate | Katherine “Kate” Austen | 3.6, 1.2, 1.3, 2.9, 1.12, 1.16, 1.22, 3.15, 4.4, 4.12 | 678 |
Key events
| Theme | Relevant Episodes | Theories |
|---|---|---|
| Locke Can Walk | 270 |
Similar theories
| Title | Author | Cmnts | Votes | Rating |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Locke The Bright Fish - | notlost | 4 | 5 | −5 |
Wow, really good theory, Sorta throws every theory I have ever written out of the window but I love your angle. Kate would be a massive twist although I think she lacks the leadership qualities to lead the others. Dont forget that it certainly looks like Claire killed her mother in the car crash there could be other characters that have killed thier fathers. think your in the right direction but not sure if Kate is the answer she just seems more of a follower than a leader.
Forgot to rate and had another thought, Ben lied to the others and has told them he was born on the island so this must be relevent. If Locke is a red herring and the prophecy is correct, maybe further flashbacks will reveal that Alex is actually Ben’s daughter and not the French Womans as we are lead to believe. Maybe Alex will kill Ben in the finale and forfill the prophecy. now she could potentially lead and she may have been born on the island. if this is correct I’d pick Alex over Kate anyday.
Wow Daryn/Sleepz This is good I really think you are both onto something here. Sleepz good angle - I have posted my own version hope you dont mind Daryn with your entry included sleeps.
Sounds good and very likely. Is John going to survive being shot in the stomach in the middle of the jungle, and why didn’t Ben just finish him if he wanted him dead so bad. Also who is Jacob and what is he, if he can be held captive by a ring of some strange substance around his dwelling, is he some kind of spirit?
The Echo Travels…
Everything has been leading up to locke becoming the leader of the others. Even in the real world.
The island/Jacob or even another force conspired to save locke.
The only reason his father tricked him out of a kidney was so that he would hate him so much that he would want him dead and thus forfil a requirement of the others to become their leader.
Also having his kidney removed has saved his life coz that is were he was shot, its now just a case of him simply being healed.
I think Locke did not told them He killd his father? and there is someone -maybe a very old one Other- who gave the Sawyer files to Locke so he actually know the truth about the killing. (sorryformyeng.)
Actually, in the same episode where it was revealed Kate killed her stepfather, it was revealed the man she killed was her real father… in fact, that’s WHY she killed him.
And so far it does look as though Kate is the only person who has killed her father, still without remorse.
But I’m not so sure “killing one’s father” is really the most important thing that denotes the leader of the Others. Perhaps Ben wants people to think this is true (perhaps not, I don’t know). But I think Richard may hold the answers regarding what’s really going on with the Others. (Ben really has only revealed to us what he wants to be going on with the Others… what is actually happening might be completely different.)
You’re right, ProfOzone, the fact that Kate killed her real father was revealed that episode. I forgot which episode it was, I just verified that he was, indeed, her real father.
And, we do know more about the Others than what Ben says. We do know that the Others were VERY led by Ben. This is a group of strong people, people willing to kill. And yet, they are also SO willing to FOLLOW Ben. Someone who wasn’t even originally part of their group and did not totally join them until relatively recently. That’s a pretty strong statement, and indicates a strong belief in something. It suggests religion, of some sort. When Locke was at their camp, they were now transfixed on HIM. He was told – “Don’t mind them, they’re just really excited that you’re here.” Why? What makes Locke so special to these people? It has to be something, and something they thought about Locke before he arrived.
When Ben tried to get Locke to kill his Dad, the Others were fascinated. They were very eager to see the outcome. And, when Locke didn’t do it, Ben said “Sorry. He’s not who we thought he was.” These people believe in something. And it clearly has something to do with Locke killing his dad.
When Locke brought his dad’s body back, the Others were taken back and wide-eyed. And then something very strange happened – from that point on, LOCKE CALLED THE SHOTS.
The others all seemed taken back by the idea of Locke going to Jacob, but said nothing. When news came of Naomi arriving with a two-way radio, Ben put that as priority #1. Naturally, they MUST stop her from bringing others to their island. He told Locke this would have to come first. Locke responded by beating up Mikhail. NO ONE even TRIED to stop him. Then he told Ben “No.” AND BEN accepted LOCKE’S command – IN FRONT OF HIS PEOPLE! Why? Ben is the leader. That really suggests that Ben CAN’T disobey Locke anymore in front of the others. And that suggests that the others, at that point, now see Locke as the man in charge.
Daryn: awesome, awesome comment, dude. Very good points made… and WELL made.
But I gotta say kat’s got some serious insight here as well.
Frankly, I sometimes wonder just what the Others saw while John was about to kill his father. I mean, if we’re going to be throwing stuff into the mix that some people can see/hear but not others, then a lot of possibilities open up.
I know, I know… that’s kind of “out there”. But to be honest I just think all we’ve been given for several episodes is more questions without many answers.
kat, you mentioned some glitches in another post… I think I’m seeing what you mean.
Er… specifically I know I’ve rated this post but for me it’s showing as having no ratings yet.
Nice post! You make some very compelling statements, and in part, I do think you’re right. I also think Prof and kat make some compelling remarks, and feel it’s too soon to see the full picture, as to what the Others reasoning is.
I’ve been reading a lot of all of your theories regarding the killing of the father and what significance that might have.
Whatever is going on, I do not think it can be determined based on what the hostiles/others are going along with. They never know what is really going on, because Ben is so clever and manipulative he only lets certain people know certain things, and even then he is lying to them half of the time. So if they do believe that a sacrifice is imperative, it is because Ben has led them to believe that. Yes, we know Richard precedes Ben, but we really can’t account for any other the other “others” arrival into the group. Obviously some are not from the island originally, Juliette being the prime example of how a normal seemingly decent person in the outside world can come to the island and beled to do and believe all sorts of things.
I think the points about Kate are really great, I had honestly forgotten that whole discovery of Wayne being her biological father. I also think that just because she doesn’t “act like a leader” that doesn’t necessarily mean anything. She leads by example. She is quite skilled when it comes to tracking and is always one of the first people to want to help out and take things on herself.
At the same time, and I believe it was Katrina’s theory, I am really into the idea that communication with Jacob requires a pureness of being, that Ben no longer possesses, having murdered so many. We really do not know how much Real communication with Jacob he has had beyond that point, if any. Let’s not forget how surprised Ben seemed when John heard Jacob speak, like he had a reason to not expect it (i.e. believing that Locke had made the same sacrifice he did).
Now we shall have to wait and see if it was really Locke who killed Naomi (someone posted an interesting theory on it being Walt, who was taught to throw knives quite well by John). If John has indeed now killed, will that affect his purity? At this point I do think that Walt was a vision or premonition/ a la Smokey or Jacob… I do not believe we have seen the last of Walt, but I also do not think he is literally on the island as others have speculated.
Nice! I have been wondering about the significance of fathers, even posted about it last night.
Here’s a thought…in a roundabout way Jack killed his father. He is the one who got him fired and sent him into the drinking binge that finally killed him.
So could Jack be the one the Others are looking for to lead them?
Walt and Micheal would still have to be on the island somewhere wouldn’t they? I doubt they just sailed away on a tug boat when you need a submarine to leave the island. Didn’t Desmond try and leave on a sail boat and end up right back on the island?
Wow excellant theory, I really love it But I reckon Walt will Kill his Father, Michael, and become the leader yeah!
In the first season, John locke ain’t afraid by the black smoke even if it grab him to try to take him underneath, as he say to jack ” leave me, it will not harm me…” How locke can be so confident ?
In season 3, episode 12 at approximatively 12 min of the show, Mikhail is arguing about the “list”saying why Sayid, Kate and Locke aren’t on it, after telling to Kate and Sayid in a sarcastic way that he “don’t know them” he say something very important to Locke before being interrupted by Rousseau, what he say is : “…because the John Locke i know was a para…” parawhat ? So Mikhael KNOW john locke but the way he say that it’s like he’s talking about another J.locke than the one in front of him…or not ? More on this episode is the fact that J.Locke is simulating assassination of Mikhael, why John pushed him in the EM fence for nothing ? Could he know, like Mikhail will tell in a further episode, that the fence wasn’t on a lethal setting ?
This said, IF john is manipulating ppl around him for whatever purpose it is, he DO know that killing his father to join with “the others” ain’t the good thing to do for him so the father assassination could put Ben and Kate, the only ones who have really did it, on a same fate. Good or Bad ?
heyy.. i thnk ur theory is believable but still richard must hav the profiles of every character including kate, and if its true that the leader should kill his father the others wwould hav known its kate, and picked her i.. but instead richard told locke and gave him the folder and told him that smone else could do it for you like sawyer.. so ur theory is great but unlikely.. i dunnu wat do u thnk?
Fantastic theory. +1. The fact that Kate killed her father DOES mean something, I think. But the Others seem to recognize who is “special” and who is not. Like Walt, Walt is “special”. Locke is “special”.
The commenter that thinks Walt will eventually kill his dad, may be right. Walt is definitely special for his own reasons, and the only person in the show that has been on the island WITH his father outside of Locke and Ben.
The Others know the background to every character. Surely they would know that Kate had killed her father, and would therefore suspect that she could be “the one”. Unless, of course, they’re sexist, and can’t see her as a leader.
However, I admit that Locke seems an unlikely leader of the Others. While he’s proud and flattered that they think he’s their Messiah, he doersn’t really like them, and only pretended to kill his father so that he could find out about the island. He’s curious, but is not the Other’s leader.
That being said, that doesn’t mean that he’s not A Messiah - just not the Others’.
How do you guys figure that Locke didn’t kill his father? He certainly arranged for his death.
I’m a lawyer, (though not a criminal lawyer) and I just don’t see how Locke avoids a conviction for murder, or solicitation for murder, or conspiracy to murder.
How can anyone justify Locke’s having clean hands?
Anything that ultimately leads me to Kate is fine by me.
Wow. Dude wish I could give +2 for this one. Great theorie.
I kinda think that maybe Ben shot him where he did because he knew that he was missing a kidney and knew he wouldnt die from the wound, he did this so locke could be “reborn” again.
good point, it seems like a twist lost writers would make, +1 to that.
still, i really hope kate doesn’t turn out to be the chosen one. sorry kate fans, but to me she’s a whining drama queen who causes nothing but trouble. even rose would make a better leader.
also if memory serves i recall sun talking to jins ‘dad’ about how his mother was a prostitue so he might not actually be the father, not relevant to the whole leader of the others thing but i thought i should remind you
I do think there is something to the whole “father thing.” Even Boone and Shannon had some father issues (sorry I can’t remember them right now, but I know one of their bio fathers was dead).
I also think that Locke has some sort of “God” complex at times and think that he may be shown up soon. I think Locke is a pawn in this thing.
Great insight on Kate. The fact that she has assumed the responsibility of raising Aaron in the flashforwards is proof alone. Kate has always had her head screwed on straight. She gets it.
It appears she will complete her path of redemption (from captured fugitive). The arch of her tale is indeed that of a Hero.
Great theory, the finale has shown half of the theory to be true! Locke is now the leader of the Others. Also, since 3 years in the future, he ends up dead…this means the others need a new leader - perhaps this is why Ben insists to Jack that ALL of the Oceanic 6 need to go back to the island.
Whether or not this theory turns out to be true: seriously every character has father issues, even Aaron and Sun and Jin’s child have father issues!!
Jack could have killed is Father indirectly… as far as I can remember we don’t find out why Christian died, I think the last time you see him before he dies is in Sawyer’s flashback…
What I’m pretty much getting at is that Christian may have killed himself, and Jack would have started the chain of events that lead to this.
If you think about it Jack fits far better than Kate. And if you keep in mind the theory which ties Jack to Jacob, it makes for some interesting thinking.
Kate was supposed to be the leader after Jacks death on the Pilot, but the writers were forced to change the script by the producers. So it does make some sense, but then again the Hostile have files on everyone. They would have taken Kate if they believed that their leader would kill his father.